The Mahakumbh may be over, but the questions and debates surrounding it are yet to end. There are questions such as if a holy dip actually washes away all your sins and takes you along the path to heaven straight away, let alone giving you immortality. There are also questions whether the apparent opulence and media hype over the Mahakumbh actually makes any sense.

Padma Bhushan Sri M (who was born as Mumtaz Ali into a Muslim family on 6 November 1949 in Thiruvananthapuram, Kerala), a spiritual teacher, social reformer, educationist, author and global speaker, has answers to these questions. For Sri M, who led the ‘Walk of Hope’ in 2015- 16 from Kanyakumari to Kashmir spanning 15 months and 7,500 kms across 11 states of India, touching more than 10 million lives, it is a journey that continues. He speaks to Ritwik Mukherjee of The Statesman from his YogaDham akhada at Prayagraj.

Advertisement

Q: What is the special significance of Kumbh or Mahakumbh?

A: They say that in the early Puranic history when Samudra Manthan happened, and the Asuras took the ‘amrita’ and left, and they had to get it back from there, some amrit spilled over and fell in four places. I mean, this is what the Purana says. And one of the four places is Prayagraj; the others are Ujjain, Nashik and Haridwar. These are the four places. So, the Kumbh is celebrated in all these places. It is called Kumbh because of the Kumbh in which the amrit was carried. It’s also called Kumbh because here it is like a big cauldron. Then came Adi Shankar Bhagvatpada, who decided that this should go on in all four places. So he organized this for the first time as a Kumbh in which he said, first it will be near a holy river, where people can go and have a dip. Now Ganga, Yamuna, and Saraswati, which they say is underground (we can’t see), became a venue. This is the concept. So he organized this, where people from all denominations and all the paramparas in this country can come together in one place for a holy dip, but only on certain auspicious occasions when there is a star position. So there is Kumbh, there is Ardha Kumbh, there is Poorna Kumbh. And now this time round, it is called Maha Kumbh because it happens once in a hundred years or so (some say 144 years).

Q: This is also called Amrit Kumbh; Amrit, which is like nectar that gives one immortality. But doesn’t it defy the concept of mortality, which says one, who is born, has to die? Because the moment you say that you go there, take a holy dip, and then you become immortal.

A: No, no. If you take a holy dip, you don’t become immortal. Take a holy dip, but amrit does not make you deathless, because that is something which we have to do ourselves, through our own personal sadhana. If you take a dip, your body is purified, your efforts may improve. Amrit actually means ‘undying’. But in such places, the influence of various holy men is there, which is never born, therefore never dies. That which is born has to die. Tomorrow you’ll go and see in the town, many Akhadas have been removed…all the Akhadas, all types of sadhus…everything.

Q: The driver who brought us here all the way from Kolkata, this man is a Muslim, named Khalid. Khalid was telling us that this will be his fourth time taking a holy dip at Kumbh. And he was quite upbeat about this. So, does it not signify some kind of confluence of ideas, different religious belief and faiths?

A: In today’s India, 90 per cent of the Muslims have Hindu origins and Hindu ethos, deep down. They were all converted for various reasons. But somewhere, in their minds, in their genes, these things are there. I had a Muslim driver, some time back. We took him to Haridwar. It may not be Kumbh but a lot of people go there also and take holy dips in the river. He asked me, “Sir, can I go there? Can I take a dip, because I think only Brahmins go there?” I told him, “Go, nobody is going to ask you anything. How many thousands of people are there? Go and take a dip. Go there around 1 o’clock in the afternoon. He roamed around in the city and went to the river around that time and took a bath and came back. I asked him – how was it? How did he feel? And he said, “I don’t know, but something happened from inside. I felt something had gone out of my body. I felt relieved and clean from inside. I felt something good has happened to me. I don’t know how and why it happened, but I felt that way.”

Q: There is also this concept of ‘paap’ (bad deeds) and ‘puniya’ (good deeds). People who come here, most of them come here with the belief that once they take a holy dip, they will be going to heaven. How far is this true and justified?

A: It’s a ritual always-in all places, in all religions. Water has been associated with cleaning agents. Even in Christianity, how do you baptize? You pour water. Jesus met John the Baptist crossing the river. He had to take a dip. When a Muslim goes for prayer, he has to wash his feet. Even if he doesn’t bathe, he has to wash. So all these have to be done with water. Water, by nature, is divine. It has a connection with this process. You wash or take a bath and you feel, ah, now I have washed my body. You feel something from inside. According to folklore, river Ganga told Bhagirath that she would not come down because there were hundreds of ‘papis’ taking a bath and that her water would get dirty. Bhagirath said, but it comes from Gomukh, which is in the Himalayas. Great sages live there in the Himalayas, including Mahadeva. So, one such person taking a dip is enough to wipe out millions of papas. So, the water will get constantly purified.

Q: Do you think this kind of opulence, making it an event and inviting celebrities, has some positive connotation?

A: We have all these, but it is also part of organizing, part of the, what shall I say, media hype. It is there, I agree with that. But that is not the essence. It is not the essence, for sure. In fact, if you go, you might see some sadhus living in a single tent and think. They are doing their oblation. They are going to the Ganga. They are meditating. They are lighting their lamps. On their own.

Q: But the type of works we have seen here within these premises – this Annadan, Sadhusevas, Chantings, I mean, this definitely has some special significance?

A: Of course. There is no better punya for human beings than anna daan, feeding sadhus. Punya means anything that takes you on to moksha. One does not know the significance of feeding sadhus, what is the feeling? You will know only if you were a sadhu once. But you’re looking around and seeing where God is. It is called “Annam Brahma” and rightly so.

Q: In one of your novels “Sunya”, the main character or protagonist is Sunya. What would Sunya have done if he had come here?

A: Nobody can say. Sunya was unpredictable. Who knows? Maybe, he would have sat at the banks of the river with us. He could have done anything. He could have actually done anything.

Q: It’s like cricket. Nothing can be predicted until the last ball is bowled?

A. So many people come here and, quite interestingly, you go outside, everybody is asking if you have taken the dip? But here, once you come inside Yogadham, nobody is talking about taking a dip. They are in a different place altogether. They are taking a dip in the spiritual atmosphere, that’s why they are not talking about the outer dip. But I still suggest it’s a good idea to have a dip.

Q: In today’s context, in India, do you think we should have more such events where there can be a confluence of ideas, thoughts, and tolerance?

A: We can have events, but it will not be called the Kumbh. It’s a very good idea, for instance, to call the Vaishnavites and the Shaivites and have a dialogue. As long as you are sure they don’t come too close. I mean, this is also there. So, if possible, it would be a great thing. This is required in today’s context. It should be a quiet, nice place with the water, with the river flowing, and a lot of breeze, fresh air. In such a place, put up tents and let people meet.